View Full Version : ADSL2+ Pricing CONFIRMED...walk this way...
Afternoon Ladies and Gentlemen from a very overcast Manchester!
We are pleased to confirm the launch of our ADSL2+ 24Mb plans. Although we have published these new plans, they will not be available for purchase until next month (June) and the availability is of course are dependent on your exchange being upgraded to the 21CN WBC products.
The prices have been confirmed as "final" by Entanet - therefore we do not expect the prices to change before actual launch. Other resellers may offer different prices, but we are sticking to the base Entanet prices to ensure the lowest prices to new and existing customers.
The new plans can be viewed here - http://adsl24.co.uk/broadband_24mb.php
We're happy to answer any questions wherever possible
This thread will be UNLOCKED for sensible discussion and comments, play nice.....
So.
Any questions? (and no love in an elevator thanks Dae)
Update:
28/5/08
Following on from Partner and customer feedback, we wish to assure you that we are committed to supplying an ADSL2+ product set that works for our Partners and end users. As such we intend to review the off peak hours associated with the ADSL2+ product package post launch. We aim to review the hours within 2 months of the product launch and commit to making appropriate changes where necessary, once the traffic patterns have been identified. We will of course communicate the results of the review to you as soon as possible and want to assure you that we do take customer and Partner feedback seriously.
(reserving post 2 for FAQ)
If I went over to the ADSL2 package can I go back to the old 8mb Home broadband package if I become scared of the increase in speed....?
Nice1.. day after I asked for an updated .. its here.
Seriously .. your service rocks.. its the only one I have found that takes care of customer needs more then anyone else around..
Now that the ADSL24s head is floating in air..
I can't wait to sign up for one of the packages..
but .. hey. it seems you guys are offering everything a customer needs.. top-ups.. i mean.. why would one not want to get this.. as an emergency backup.. seriously.. what's the next thing u gonna offer..
And ofcourse.. above stuff comes with a question..
Office Premium.... does that offer more upload rates or something along those grounds.. unfortunately I tend to WFH (work from home) some days.. and hence shifted to the office 45 plan on my current package.. just for the bigger upload rate.. however.. 1.4 mb..thats flippin fast.. so perhaps i presume it offers more "contention" ration correct?
P..S Thanks one again for the details.. much appreciated... and as a suggestion... noticed there is not a a middle between 34 and 80 gig package.. It would be nice to have one.. but I presume this has been strategically thought off.
TheHerbster
23/05/2008, 18:35
What can I say... you guys rock!
Great pricing, great service. No wonder adsl24 is expanding. Well done guys.
Keep up the good work. I recommend you guys to everyone who needs a new isp. :D
mart the fart
23/05/2008, 18:37
give me option 80 NOWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW
mart the fart
23/05/2008, 18:38
James Tell Bt To Upgrade My Exchange Plzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
If I went over to the ADSL2 package can I go back to the old 8mb Home broadband package if I become scared of the increase in speed....?
Unsure, although unlikely, once you make the move I believe thats it.
Nice1.. day after I asked for an updated .. its here.
Seriously .. your service rocks.. its the only one I have found that takes care of customer needs more then anyone else around..
Now that the ADSL24s head is floating in air..
I can't wait to sign up for one of the packages..
but .. hey. it seems you guys are offering everything a customer needs.. top-ups.. i mean.. why would one not want to get this.. as an emergency backup.. seriously.. what's the next thing u gonna offer..
And ofcourse.. above stuff comes with a question..
Office Premium.... does that offer more upload rates or something along those grounds.. unfortunately I tend to WFH (work from home) some days.. and hence shifted to the office 45 plan on my current package.. just for the bigger upload rate.. however.. 1.4 mb..thats flippin fast.. so perhaps i presume it offers more "contention" ration correct?
P..S Thanks one again for the details.. much appreciated... and as a suggestion... noticed there is not a a middle between 34 and 80 gig package.. It would be nice to have one.. but I presume this has been strategically thought off.
Thank you ;)
All connections will have uncapped upload, IE, your upload will be the most it can, it sort of works like MAX at present with the dynamic line management. If you can support 800 and you are on home 30, you will get it, if you can support 1.4mb you can have it. No extra cost. The exchange priority is a "bolt on" if you will. So you are on office 45 at present. It is likely you will be moved to BBand 80 and then you just have the most upload your line can take!
With the change to offpeak 20gig more bandwidth peak is not a bad trade off. We BELIEVE them to be final but still an unspecified amount of time from launch so things could change...
What can I say... you guys rock!
Great pricing, great service. No wonder adsl24 is expanding. Well done guys.
Keep up the good work. I recommend you guys to everyone who needs a new isp. :D
Thank you :p
give me option 80 NOWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW
Wait your turn soldier ;)
James Tell Bt To Upgrade My Exchange Plzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
(Mine is done already....)
Sounds good to me matey. Allowance, times etc, all fine
Get me hooked up by monday will ya! :D
tinyclanger
23/05/2008, 20:22
TC is moaning....:p
..because I live in the sticks, it'll be eons before my exchange is enabled.
Clangers are by nature jealous little creatures, so I will sit here and watch (and very possibly seethe a little bit) while the rest of you have blazing fast connections:eek:
..by the time I do get enabled, you lot will likely have downloaded the whole internet and there won't be any left for me ;)
...moaning has ended ...for now ...
:D:D:D
TC is moaning....:p
..because I live in the sticks, it'll be eons before my exchange is enabled.
Clangers are by nature jealous little creatures, so I will sit here and watch (and very possibly seethe a little bit) while the rest of you have blazing fast connections:eek:
..by the time I do get enabled, you lot will likely have downloaded the whole internet and there won't be any left for me ;)
...moaning has ended ...for now ...
:D:D:D
Yeh, I agree TC, leave us poor buggers in the cold as usual!!
/me watches the morons moan about losing 1mb from 8128 sync.....
Set those clangers on em TC!
/me has snr of 15 with 8128 ;)
/me has snr of 15 with 8128 ;)
Oh, How am I going to pick on you now aye :D
tinyclanger
23/05/2008, 21:44
*pokes James with sharp sticks*
hiya JamesL's like others have said regarding ages before we get enabled for 21 cn , will that mean the prices might drop on other products ? ,,
me hopes my exchange date comes fast
________
video reviews (http://videoreviews.org)
tboorman
23/05/2008, 22:16
The pricing certainly looks excellent value for money - well done ADSL24/Entanet. Just one question - how is the ALT going to work with the 24 Mbps products?
It will still be present but not required as much due to the off-peak changes. This means the 10PM and weekend slowdown will not be present and thus the only times it will be lower speeds will be between 1am and 7am which is 99% of the time fine for the majority.
petrolhead
23/05/2008, 22:24
Nice prices.
Now, do I hold on til my exchange is upgraded Q1 2009, or migrate to Be when they unbundle my exchange at the end of June? Decisions...decisions...
hiya JamesL's like others have said regarding ages before we get enabled for 21 cn , will that mean the prices might drop on other products ? ,,
me hopes my exchange date comes fast
AFAIK you will continue on your current package till you get 21CN enabled meaning peak/off peak wont change till the exchange is upgraded.
Nice prices.
Now, do I hold on til my exchange is upgraded Q1 2009, or migrate to Be when they unbundle my exchange at the end of June? Decisions...decisions...
Depends on how much you love me and t'other James ;)
will you offer 2.5 mbps upload in the future other than that the packages look SWEET shame i got to wait so long
the offpeak time changes dont seem so great.... means most people will be using more of their peak allowance now and probably not using much offpeak. so going to be getting three times the current speed but a third of the allowance to use it on :S
ramstell
24/05/2008, 07:26
Which modem/router would you recommend for use with the new ADSL2+ service?
Which modem/router would you recommend for use with the new ADSL2+ service?
Speedtouch or Netgear DG 834GT.
tboorman
24/05/2008, 10:12
It will still be present but not required as much due to the off-peak changes. This means the 10PM and weekend slowdown will not be present and thus the only times it will be lower speeds will be between 1am and 7am which is 99% of the time fine for the majority.
I hadn't noticed the change to the off-peak times. The daytime during the weekend being considered peak time might put me off.
Once your exchange upgrades do you have to change over?
Looking at the off-peak time changes at the weekend and i would prefer to stay on my current plan
;)..I'm going to put the cat amongst the pigeons now..:p
First of all let me tell you that ADSL24 as far as I'm concerned, (in fact as far as most of us are concerned for that matter) is a pretty damn cool ISP.
With the immanent onset of 21C for those whose exchanges can be readied for it, my mates at James towers have rolled out the 24 ADSL+2 pricing and banding levels.
I'm currently a very happy Home 60 user with bags of off peak and plenty of peak usage left every month.
Reading the new tariff's I see the equivalent in my package as being the Broadband 80 plan including 24 Mbps maximum download and 1.4 Mbps upload with 80GB off peak allowance and Unlimited off peak allowance at my current tariff of £29.99.
Am I being naive or have I missed something when I see that as a consequence of a faster connection the trade off is to lose 4 hours of off peak daily allowance and all off peak allowance at the weekends with an option to top-up your peak allowance accordingly from anything from £5.00 for 10 Gig up to £360.00 for a 1000 Gig with one off payments that never expire and can be rolled over.
Most of it seems good and knowing ADSL24 it's a good well thought out deal..but to me, the sting in the tail is the off peak times :- 1.00 am to 7.00 am 7 days per week...that's only 6 hours out of 24 hours off peak unlimited usage per day..:confused:
Supose you got to ask yourself if like me, that if you were on a capped 30 gig a month Orange plan that do you actually give a damn..:D
the-bruce
24/05/2008, 14:00
The priceing seems very fair, but, a wee moan ;) (very rare)
Off-peak is defined as 1am to 7am seven days a week and offers unlimited usage with no fair usage policy.
I'm unsure if the above would work for me, but tbh my exchange has no word when its gonna be upgraded in the foreseeable future, so i'm not to fussed atm ...
Brucey
xxxxx
gbswales
24/05/2008, 14:13
I think that members should pressure entanet to offer at least the same pricing structure for those of us stuck with 8mb for some time to come - my exchange doesn't even have an estimated date.
I have posted a poll in the ADSL chat and info discusson(before i saw this thread!) Please Take the Poll (http://adsl24.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?p=61812&posted=1#post61812)
(the direct link will work but you need to scroll to the top of the page to see the poll! you do have to be logged in to take the poll)
I think we all need to make our voices heard - the current proposals mean that those lucky enough to move to even faster connections will be getting a better pricing and usage deal than those of us stuck with slow connections.
At the very least I think they should introduce something like Broadband 10 for us - that is 10GB peak, even if they left a 300GB off peak cap - 10GB is much closer to the average user and should be around £15 a month with the option of adding extra GBs for £5 rather than the current penalty scheme, which while we have all had to accept it to get the deal we want, is generally considered very unfair practice. Just because something is in the terms and conditions doesnt mean that you shouldn't campaign to change it!
gbswales
24/05/2008, 14:23
the offpeak time changes dont seem so great.... means most people will be using more of their peak allowance now and probably not using much offpeak. so going to be getting three times the current speed but a third of the allowance to use it on :S
This suprises me -:eek: seems in every apparently "good deal" there is a gotcha! Getting the internet access you need at a price you can afford seems like trying to find a mobile phone deal that suits you. The easy solution has to be that the Govenment fund BT to fibre optic every home and business line in the UK and then give everyone 24mb unlimited, uncapped unmonitored downloads for £10 a month:D funded from extra tax on higher income bands - Come on tax payers - its a great chance for the rich to give much more to the poor!:p
Off-peak is defined as 1am to 7am seven days a week
When Enta roll out the ADSL2+ service will this change to the peak/off-peak times also be applied to the 8Mbps products?
My assumption is that it will...
The daytime during the weekend being considered peak time might put me off.
I don't think you'll be the only one Tim, I can see this potentially putting a lot of users who are used to d/l virtually all weekend off.
From my point of view the changes to the peak/off-peak wouldn't really affect me as I am not that heavy a net user these days
(certainly not as much as I was in the <2Mbps Telewest days ;))
And it will most likely benefit me as I will get higher throughput over the 10pm-1am slot and better speeds over the weekend,
not that the slight slow down at these times overtly bothered me personally, but it will obviously affect some other users to a greater extent.
I can certainly understand Enta's reasoning for the change - to try and eliminate the 10pm-1am throughput reduction issue
and reduce the weekend mid afternoon slowdown - but I think there will be complaints about this.
Am I being naive or have I missed something when I see that as a consequence of a faster connection the trade off is to lose 4 hours of off peak daily allowance and all off peak allowance at the weekends
In some ways I guess this is actually a reasonably trade off as you will be able to download at a much faster rate so downloads will complete quicker,
making a loss of 4 hours off-peak less of an issue. The changes to the weekend times may not go down so well tho.
And some users will need to be scheduling d/l's and watching their peak allowances a lot more.
The people who may lose out most with the peak/off-peak changes would be the fixed/8Mbps users (if the changes apply to these products) that can't get WBC (adsl2+) connections on their exchanges, which I should think is still currently a large number of Entanet's customer base.
Certainly there are no current plans/timetable for WBC on my current exchange or the exchange where I am moving to in the next few months :(
If you go over your allowance, you will still be able to browse but at a reduced speed.
I am guessing this is to counter those that have complained about the charges levied when they have gone over their allowances early?
I would like to see how this is achieved, it sounds a bit like the throttling (or at least heavy traffic management policies) used by some other ISP's ...
and the reason many users may have left them?
Anyway it will be interesting to see how the first users of the new services/products get on when it is fully deployed ... :cool:
gillmacca
24/05/2008, 14:35
I notice it mentions unlimited. Will all the isp's around offering unlimited with catches, how unlimited is this actually?
Could I download everyday, off-peak, non-stop with out any problems, or is there really a limit (just so high that entanet think most people won't reach it)
I am not bothered about the new off-peak time (except weekends), as I would be able to download at nearly 3 times the speed I currently do, so I think it would make up for it (again not too happy with the weekend off-peak)
Is this new off-peak time just for people on 24mbps, or is it everyone. If everyone, when does the new off-peak start?
tboorman
24/05/2008, 14:41
With the increase in popularity of things like the BBC's iPlayer, people are likely to be downloading more at what will be peak time with the 24 Mbps plans, so reducing the off-peak hours seems like a backwards step to me.
the-bruce
24/05/2008, 14:50
With the increase in popularity of things like the BBC's iPlayer, people are likely to be downloading more at what will be peak time with the 24 Mbps plans, so reducing the off-peak hours seems like a backwards step to me.
Yep then more money for top ups thus squeezing more cash out of the customers ..
Brucey
xxxxx
smartybones
24/05/2008, 15:09
whaterver hapens, someone is going to complain......
myself, i was expecting a price hike with ADSL2, and when i see a price plan that is the same as i am on now, I assumed there was a catch.... the change in peak / offpeak hours...
but, take into the equasion of the expected price hike, the 29.99 service looks like it will be the one i will be going for. the added peak time allowance makes up for the change in peak times....
but in the meantime, i am still verry happy with my 8mb MAX service, its still good value for moneym and even if the peak times change along with the adsl2 packages, it really wont make that much difrence to me. Maybe it will anoy a few of the freetards enough that they jump ship and free up some of the bandwith for more reasonable users....
Hi people were can i find more info on adsl2+ form enta/adsl24 like the profile system and fault reporting
thanks for any help
Jamie
Hi Jamie,
This should give you an over view of how 21CN & broadband (http://www.samknows.com/broadband/21cn_broadband.php) and the new DLM settings are supposed to work.
Just to put a finer point on it..it's still a bit of a bugger for the folks who can only get speeds like 2meg and can only dream of faster internet speeds however slightly faster they may be..:(
I personally like a lot of folks on here have the, (UP TO) 8 meg dilemma, where lots of factors involved either makes your speeds go whoosh or make them go plop!!
My profile is 4000 with a Sync speed of 4544...my Line Attenuation downstream is 36.0 db and 20.0 db upstream, my noise margin is 14.3 Downstream and 23.0 db upstream.... running a speed test with "Speedtest.net" it comes out at around 3831 down and 370 up..very commendable speeds but less than half of my 8 meg considering that I only live 1.15 km (as the crow flies) from my exchange, as I said though, lots of other factors involved too!
When I'm eligible for 24 meg I've been told that I can expect around 8-9 meg, not a problem to me price wise but my off peak usage has been massacred for very little gain in speed as has been mentioned before in this thread...:(
What do you guys think:)
M@rk....:D
The overall issue is that the allowances were far too generous to start with and losing Enta a lot of money every month. Offering a service with 330GB bandwidth for £19.99 was a mistake by Enta in the beginning and meant that it simply was not sustainable and caused all sorts of issues such as the 10PM crawl and slowdowns most of the weekend.
When you compare the new prices with the current, it looks like you are losing out, but for the majority of people, it will be better overall. People want as much bandwidth as possible, as fast a speed as possible and for as cheap as possible, but that just isn't viable in the broadband market if today unless you go for one of the "big named ISPs" and have a woeful service, poor speeds and not very good support.
Look at the bigger picture -
1) More peak allowance
2) Higher download speeds (for most, even if just a little)
3) Higher upload speeds (1Mb+ for most)
4) Better stability as ADSL2+ offers many advantages over plain ADSL
5) Unlimited off-peak (as others say, you are not losing the 300GB off-peak, you are getting more off-peak allowance as it's not monitored!, albeit at a later time during the night - but does this really matter - you are paying for peak bandwidth, schedule your downloads and enjoy unlimited off-peak!)
6) No overusage fees (£5+vat admin fee etc) and the ability to just topup if you require it. Topups do not expire and roll over each month until used up
7) Ability to change target SNR profiles (not fully confirmed yet!) (Normal = 6dB SNR, Stable = 9 or 12dB SNR and Super stable = 15dB SNR we think) - helping many people who have line issues or an SNR that is too high and causing lower SYNC speeds.
If you just compare it with the existing package, you are getting more speed, more overall allowance with the peak and off-peak periods (regardless of the times) and the above advantages to point out a few.
I do know that Enta has spent millions in investments for 21CN, and are the first ISP to have such a presence on the 21CN scene which is a credit to their network and planning team. I still believe the prices that are being offered (especially up to the Broadband 35 package) are very competive and even break in to the LLU price range for many. If you were to not know the current packages, would you still think the new ones are not competitive? Enta have to make some money back before they even break even no doubt.
I appreciate the plans may not suit everyone, which is why we will not be forcing any customers to take up the above packages when their exchange is upgraded. The line will be migrated to the WBC platform, but you will remain on the ADSL1 profile and plan. We will e-mail every customer in advance to inform you that you are able to change the package from a date and then it's up to you :)
We've done lookups on our customer base and actually find that over 60% of customers on the current 30GB package are actually using less than 10GB peak under the new peak times, so for these it will actually mean that they could go for the Broadband 10 package, save £5 each month, and have higher speeds and all the other benefits. We will lose a lot of commission per month from Enta but that's what we have to do for our customers as they come first - plus our hands are tied by Enta so we have to make the most of what they have announced.
James
will you offer 2.5 mbps upload in the future other than that the packages look SWEET shame i got to wait so long
Yes, this will be offered as soon as BT confirm the launch of it :)
hmmm, im not sure all these are plus points.
"1) More peak allowance"
but theres now more peak allowance hours! so per peak hour theres less allowance. in the home60 8mb price plan theres 60gb for around 20days a month. thats 3gb a day (and about 0.21gb an hour) now in the equivalent priced 24mb price plan theres 80gb for on average 30 days a month peak...thats only 2.6gb a day. and for 4hrs longer too so you get 0.16gb per hour. also you have the ability to download and use up the allowance three times quicker.
"5) Unlimited off-peak (as others say, you are not losing the 300GB off-peak, you are getting more off-peak allowance as it's not monitored!, albeit at a later time during the night - but does this really matter - you are paying for peak bandwidth, schedule your downloads and enjoy unlimited off-peak!)"
there maybe unlimited off peak. but thats not until 1am, so yes i would say it matters! not everyone can leave their pc on all night and most probably dont. so the majority of people will never get to use their off peak allowance at all. i know i certainly wont be able to use more than an hour off peak a day.
i think i could live with the 1am peak time during the week if the weekend was still off peak. as it is, switching to 24mb would be massively more expensive. ive got an xbox360 and a ps3 and on average a demo is over 1gb and a film on the xbox can be upto 4gb. also more games are being offered to buy as downloads -GT5 was somethin like 4gb. so it certainly doesnt take long to rack up the gb's.
i suppose one good thing is that as people start switching to the 24mb service then possibly a side effect will be an improvement in the 8mb service because there will be less people using it. although i will say that even at the busiest period around 10pm to midnight the service is still very good and i get a very acceptable speed the majority of times.
@ Dae Thanks read before was really wondering about the faults more than anything like when we have a prob with our profile adsl24 have to ask bt to sort it would be very very (I Think) nice if adsl24 could do this there self
@James Thank you the Icing on the cake can you give me the cherry to :):):)
Laser157
24/05/2008, 21:30
I agree with gbswales. New plans should be available on 8gig Max too - as an option.
Useful explanation of the strategy from James. Makes a lot of sense to me, and I was pleased to read we may have some options for target SNRs on the new system.
24Mb Broadband 35
^^ Looks sweet as for me, not a single price change, but double my current downstream speed and a sweet 1.4Mbps upload? Too good to pass up! Also a big ++ that it's with Entanet/ADSL24. ;)
Can't wait. :)
Although, my ADSL24 Account Page says my exchange is set to be upgraded to 21CN between 19th February 2009 to 19th May 2009.. Yet on SamKnows.com, it states for my exchange that the '21CN PSTN Switchover Target' is Q3 2008; not sure what this is? Although it does say above it, '21CN WBS Status', presume this mean it goes live (?) on 19th May 2009..
Ugh..? :(
No wonder why i came here ADSL24/Enta , Straight forward , very helpfull .
But i would like to see a change to the packages on max products , BUT if there gonna stay the same , then no worries , with the Service have Recieved since my migrating i'll be staying :)
________
Bandit Series (http://www.suzuki-tech.com/wiki/Suzuki_Bandit_Series)
With the changes to offpeak times the 3GB package that is just about enough for me at the moment would be insufficient, but the 10GB would be more than adequate and slightly cheaper, so from my point of view it is better. For those who need, or should I say want, unlimited downloads is the timing of that facility between 1am and 7am really such a burden, surely machines can be set to do these downloads automatically, I can't believe people sit at their PC's watching it all happen.
The 1am to 7am for off peak seems perfectly reasonable to me. It is easy enough to schedule any downloads to run, then automatically shut off the computer when finished.
Also if you want to look at it in terms of pure bandwidth, the length of off peak has halved (12 hours down to 6 hours), but the speed is tripled (theoretically).
on SamKnows.com, it states for my exchange that the '21CN PSTN Switchover Target' is Q3 2008; not sure what this is? Although it does say above it, '21CN WBS Status', presume this mean it goes live (?) on 19th May 2009..
Ugh..? :(
'21CN PSTN Switchover Target' is your BT phone service switchover date - so this can be ignored for now. The 21CN WBC status of 19th May is the latest date BT will upgrade the exchange to WBC ADSL2+, and 19th Feb 2008 is the earliest :)
I agree with gbswales. New plans should be available on 8gig Max too - as an option.
The current plans can't be changed as the way it is delivered is different to the way WBC ADSL2+ products are delivered in terms of the backhaul to/from BT. The current setup uses Central pipes which cost £millions whereas the new system does not and allows Enta to offer a little more without as much overheads. So the normal 8Mb plans cannot be changed as they are too cheap at the moment (Enta are losing large amounts on the 30/300 GB plan!)
James
Beta_Tester
25/05/2008, 00:21
Do you have any news from Enta on how the IP profiling system will work?
Do you have any news from Enta on how the IP profiling system will work?
Similar but a SHED load of profiles.
And i mean a SHED load.
Plus setting you line "normal" (6db snr), stable (9 or 12) and super stable (15 snr)
Beta_Tester
25/05/2008, 01:16
Will it react more quickly though? Being stuck at 165kbps (due to a fault on your line) for 3 days is very baaaad.
garfield
25/05/2008, 08:51
With the increase in popularity of things like the BBC's iPlayer, people are likely to be downloading more at what will be peak time with the 24 Mbps plans, so reducing the off-peak hours seems like a backwards step to me.
After reading the page properly this time, I have to agree, 3 times the speed but a drastic loss in off peak allowance 6 hours per night for me. So i will lose 90hrs per week in off peak allowance.
I thought the days had gone of leaving the computer on all night, being enviromentally friendly, and besides that, the likes of ITV catch up service, and BBCi you cannot schedule a night download for it.
I would rather stick with a lower speed and better allowance, thankfully I am not due to change now for at least 14 months.
But the difference is that the peak period will be better and not have the same slowdowns, meaning a better overall experience as there will be no 10PM slowdown and weekend slowdown. I guess it's horses for courses so we can only offer the options and it's up to each customer to decide if they want to upgrade :)
southcote47
25/05/2008, 11:46
The change in off peak from 10pm to 1am is a big one, I guess it depends on who you are but I watch a lot of films after 10pm so this will have a big effect, also the loss of generous weekend download allowances is a big loss - i'm not sure that 20GB makes up for it at all, and the 5gb on the 30 package certainly doesn't.
The packages may seem generous but they are actually much more restrictive, that said there is some logic to this as people are going to have alot more potential to download alot - the thing is that it's only for 6 hours in the middle of the night that they can do it without worrying, rather than all weekend and at a semi reasonable time of night.
The change in off peak from 10pm to 1am is a big one, I guess it depends on who you are but I watch a lot of films after 10pm so this will have a big effect, also the loss of generous weekend download allowances is a big loss - i'm not sure that 20GB makes up for it at all, and the 5gb on the 30 package certainly doesn't.
The packages may seem generous but they are actually much more restrictive, that said there is some logic to this as people are going to have alot more potential to download alot - the thing is that it's only for 6 hours in the middle of the night that they can do it without worrying, rather than all weekend and at a semi reasonable time of night.
As said before it does look pretty bad.
But the potential is there, if you can, to get well over 300gb off peak. It should stop the 10pm slowdown and weekend lag and just requires scheduling..
merlin99
25/05/2008, 11:59
But the difference is that the peak period will be better and not have the same slowdowns, meaning a better overall experience as there will be no 10PM slowdown and weekend slowdown. I guess it's horses for courses so we can only offer the options and it's up to each customer to decide if they want to upgrade :)
i thought that for most of us the peak time was already ok and the only problem people had was the 10pm rush when speeds did drop as everyone jumped on the download wagon and yes i do include myself on that one ....i guess it will be better all week long in that the offpeak wont start till 1am when the most of us will be in bed so the sudden drop off and slow down for 2 or 3 hours a night wont now happen and a lot of the complaints will stop
as for there being no weekend slowdown thats hardly surprising when effectively the weekend offpeak wise has gone instead of the 60 hours offpeak there will only be 18, i know the speed is 3x but its really only going to be 2x for me at most going on my stats
the unlimited offpeak is nice however i believe the addition of an extra 66 hours peak time per week may well be too much for some, for me to keep to roughly the same plan and allowances ill be paying almost £47 a month
(assuming my maths are correct, im on office 45)
Soulja85
25/05/2008, 12:22
I think once my exchange gets upgraded i'll be moving to another ISP, those off peak times are just silly imo, I never see 1am!
O well :)
I think once my exchange gets upgraded i'll be moving to another ISP, those off peak times are just silly imo, I never see 1am!
O well :)
You think your going to get the same quality ISP? Every other Entanet reseller is going to be the same peak/off-peak times presumably. :rolleyes:
ADSL24 are a great ISP, I too am not impressed with the severe cut on off-peak times, but I'm still staying and am going to happily upgrade to 24Mb Broadband 35. The support is top-notch, quality is great, a friendly community forums; not many ISPs have one, let alone a close-knit and friendly one. ;)
Now I know, a lot of programs don't work with Scheduling, generally only some Torrent programs (e.g. uTorrent, I use this), and a handful of Download Managers, yet 4oD and I think BBC iPlayer doesn't work with this either...
The fact it now means I'm going to have to start leaving my PC on all night now when I upgrade, which isn't environmentally friendly, but the only time were I can download in the month and not go over my limit (peak).. It's really not working out, but I can still be happy with it; because there isn't any other ISP I could switch too that gives the support, quality and no port-blocking/throttling.
garfield
25/05/2008, 12:52
But the difference is that the peak period will be better and not have the same slowdowns, meaning a better overall experience as there will be no 10PM slowdown and weekend slowdown. I guess it's horses for courses so we can only offer the options and it's up to each customer to decide if they want to upgrade :)
Without sounding like a creep, the slowdowns don't really bother me, it only drops to 2mb, and I don't fuss over that, its to be expected, but as said, horses for courses
The change in off peak from 10pm to 1am is a big one, I guess it depends on who you are but I watch a lot of films after 10pm so this will have a big effect, also the loss of generous weekend download allowances is a big loss - i'm not sure that 20GB makes up for it at all, and the 5gb on the 30 package certainly doesn't.
The packages may seem generous but they are actually much more restrictive, that said there is some logic to this as people are going to have alot more potential to download alot - the thing is that it's only for 6 hours in the middle of the night that they can do it without worrying, rather than all weekend and at a semi reasonable time of night.
I had a look at this and realised that it is not worth my while changing over, due to the length of my line, I only get 2.5-3Mbits as it is, so going to the new service will only give me a slight speed increase or may even reduce it and I am not taking that risk. Maybe if I could change back, then I would try it.
I am not going from ADSL24, I am happy with the service I get for the price I pay. I am not a heavy user, never really going anywhere near my limits.
At the moment there are no plans to move people to ADSL2+, by force, if that happens, then I will look at other options
When Enta roll out the ADSL2+ service will this change to the peak/off-peak times also be applied to the 8Mbps products?
Is there an answer to this one James's? :)
My thinking on this is that the current peak/off-peak times on MAX services would be pulled into line with the 24Mbps WBC products as the current IPstream system is phased out and replaced with the IPstream Connect product as more exchanges switch to 21CN equipment.
And of course, as you have said, it makes better financial sense to Enta:
the allowances were far too generous to start with and losing Enta a lot of money every month. Offering a service with 330GB bandwidth for £19.99 was a mistake by Enta in the beginning and meant that it simply was not sustainable
Overall the simplification (http://www.btplc.com/21CN/Thetechnologyofthenetwork/21CNtechnologyintheUK/21CNtechnologyintheUK.htm) of the whole phone network can only be a good thing as it is a total mess of bolted on systems/technologies at the moment.
And hopefully this will lead to BT/BTw being able to deal with faults in a much better & timelier manner as fault finding should also be simplified,
but I won't be holding my breath :rolleyes:
Will Enta/ADSL24 actually have any more control over WBC connections regards faults etc than at present? (or will this only be the potential SNR margin changes?) - I think this is what JamieKG was asking about earlier in the thread.
will you offer 2.5 mbps upload in the future
Yes, this will be offered as soon as BT confirm the launch of it
This is the ADSL2+ Annex M product tho isn't it, rather than the plain MAX 24Mbps product(s)?
From my point of view (and my usage) I think that Broadband 35 would suit my needs more than adequately,
unless I start using the likes of BBCi Player a lot more than I currently do.
(Would be the streaming service only tho - don't think much of the Kontiki client used by BBCi Player and 4OD etc etc, seems very poorly implemented IMO.)
[On a side note has anyone else noticed how much junk Kontiki leaves behind when it is uninstalled?, or that kservice.exe and khost.exe are often left seeding files in the background - even when the main client is closed - unless you manually stop the service(s)? :eek:]
tboorman
25/05/2008, 14:20
As said before it does look pretty bad.
But the potential is there, if you can, to get well over 300gb off peak. It should stop the 10pm slowdown and weekend lag and just requires scheduling..
The problem is that the BBC iPlayer doesn't have any scheduling feature.
Soulja85
25/05/2008, 16:00
You think your going to get the same quality ISP? Every other Entanet reseller is going to be the same peak/off-peak times presumably. :rolleyes:
ADSL24 are a great ISP, I too am not impressed with the severe cut on off-peak times, but I'm still staying and am going to happily upgrade to 24Mb Broadband 35. The support is top-notch, quality is great, a friendly community forums; not many ISPs have one, let alone a close-knit and friendly one. ;)
Now I know, a lot of programs don't work with Scheduling, generally only some Torrent programs (e.g. uTorrent, I use this), and a handful of Download Managers, yet 4oD and I think BBC iPlayer doesn't work with this either...
The fact it now means I'm going to have to start leaving my PC on all night now when I upgrade, which isn't environmentally friendly, but the only time were I can download in the month and not go over my limit (peak).. It's really not working out, but I can still be happy with it; because there isn't any other ISP I could switch too that gives the support, quality and no port-blocking/throttling.
Stick your :rolleyes: where the sun don't shine mate.
Not every ISP has switched over to ADSL2 yet so who knows? there could be some good deals out there to be had in the future. If not i'll just stick with my office 45 for the time being and keep my options open.
Just because you're happy with the service you get now and will get in the future doesn't mean i have to be.
garfield
25/05/2008, 17:31
I can see some cracks opening here, I just don't think that the set out for it will be suitable to me as a BBCi and ITV Catch up user.
Its a shame, because apart from the few little niggles that ANYONE is bound to get, its definatley one of the better ISP's out there. That said, I will now be keeping an eye out for price releases and PEAK/OFF PEAK timing with other ISP's
from the FAQ,
* If you go over your allowance, you will still be able to browse but at a reduced speed. You can purchase a top-up (see options
above) at any time to restore the full speed or simply continue on a reduced until the usage resets on your bill date.
Ok, so it looks like you will not get charged for going over, but if you do go over, what will be the reduced speed?
Thanks
Andy
tboorman
25/05/2008, 19:10
Ok, so it looks like you will not get charged for going over, but if you do go over, what will be the reduced speed?
Entanet have not specified that yet.
With the off peak pretty much non existent I think the speed of the "reduced speed" for going over your monthly allowance will play a big part in whether Entanet keep alot of it's customers or not. It will certainly be a major deciding factor for me even though I never come close to maxing my allowance. The most I have ever used has been 12.07Gb peak and 12.09GB off peak, the minimum has been 3.59GB peak and 4.76 off peak (the peak and off peak come from different billing periods). I never come close to my limit as I'm careful as to when I download things as annoying as it is, for instance I'll wait until off peak period before downloading demos etc from PSN or Xbox Live.
According to the ADSL24 24Mb checker my enablement date is "between 19/02/2009 and 19/05/2009." and I should receive around 20Mb, but if I can receive BE before that date I'll probably go with them. I can currently receive SKY/Easynet based LLU services, but the only option for me would be UK Online (afaik) as I don't have Sky but would rather not be paying more than £20 a month and stuck in a 12 month contract.
A question that those of us who won't get 21cn for quite some time may like an answer to. Will we be able to partake of the top up pricing while we're stuck on adsl max? I'd think it would be of great help for those who occasionally sale close to the wind, so to speak.
A few answers to the last few posts:
Dae - This is the ADSL2+ Annex M product tho isn't it, rather than the plain MAX 24Mbps product(s)?
Yes, Annex M.
When Enta roll out the ADSL2+ service will this change to the peak/off-peak times also be applied to the 8Mbps products?
No, nothing will change in terms of the current package. they can't, as the product will still be delivered in the same way through BT centrals, which costs Entanet more than if you were on an ADSL2+ product using the nodes and interconnects.
Off peak times and allowance will remain the same also on the current 8mb plans.
Will Enta/ADSL24 actually have any more control over WBC connections regards faults etc than at present?
BT have revamped their internal fault system so time will tell on this one. I am sure more control will be given to the ISPs
Will we be able to partake of the top up pricing while we're stuck on adsl max?
I have not been informed that the top-ups will be brought to the current plans so I don't think so. It would require a complete re-write to the current systems whereas the new systems have been developed with top-ups nin mind. I will ask the question and let you know :)
smartybones
25/05/2008, 21:25
Well it goes like this….
You can please some of the people some of the time, but you can’t please all of the people all of the time.
If you cant, or are not willing to leave a computer on overnight between 1am and 7am to do the bulk of your downloads, then its your problem, not adsl24 or entanets problem.
If you want an Internet package that is tailor mode to your requirements there are plenty of isp’s around that you can call the sales department up, tell them your requirements and see if they can accommodate. If they can, don’t expect to pay 20 quid a month.
Remember this. ADSL24 and Entanet are businesses, and the overall purpose of that business is to make money. The way they make money is to provide a service that the customers are and will continue to be happy with. If they are not making money, then the plan has to change. Some people may not be happy with the changes, but if it comes to the point of change or shut the doors, change it must be.
I think the current plans that enta/adsl24 offer are very competitive, and I believe the new ADSL2+ plans are also very competitive. There are options for other providers, whose allowances are more generous, but I don’t believe quality of service will be up to the standards I have become accustomed to here at ADSL24.
If the plans that are on offer do not fit in with your lifestyle or network requirements, you have the option to change your requirements to fit, or change provider.
The bulk of the complaining about off-peak allowances is pathetic if you ask me. People want to set a whole pile of downloads on Friday night and suck up as much of the internet as possible until Monday morning. They bitch about how slow it is at these times and that enta need to add more capacity. GET REAL….
When I first arrived at adsl24 I was amazed at all the downloading I could actually do, and I think I have the whole of the net downloaded to my hard drives lol. But then after a few months the reality of it is this… the 30GB peak allowance is plenty enough to download what I want to download at peak times and I do not even think about off-peak and peak times any more. I bet if you look,,, all the people who download masses amounts at off-peak hours don’t even come close to using half the peak allowances.
All in all, the trade off between 30% of the off peak allowance for a 300% speed increase says to me that in all, you can download more… and as the times the off peak allowance has been taken away has been plagued by speed decreases anyway, it is my opinion people are moaning about nothing…….
For those people who do not want to leave a computer on overnight to download, mainly I assume because of the noise. You can pick up a ‘old’ PC, for next to nothing, and make it run pretty much silently, to use as a ‘downloads PC’… access it remotely, you don’t even need a keyboard or monitor
southcote47
25/05/2008, 23:49
The problem with the broadband market at the moment is that there are three levels of service:-
1. Mainstream consumer ISP's that go for headline rates, 'free' or bundled packages that sound good in the marketing but rely on the fact that the majority of home internet users won't use it much...and are starting to come unstuck. These ISP's tend to use traffic shaping in order to restrict usage and have appaling customer service.
2. The better ISP's who tend to attract customers that know what they want and recognise that they need to provide good service and not treat their customers as if they are stupid, the problem is they also attract the customers that use the net alot.
3. The non existant ISP that really can offer unlimited downloads, a true 8mbs, 16mps or 25mbs service without contention as well as good support. The reason this doesn't happen is that the pipes cost too much money, if all the customer base used even half of what was promised in the marketing the ISP's would all go bust as the back end infrastructure is being rationed effectivly by the people that own it.
The question is where is the investment in a superfast backbone network that can cope with everyones home and work internet connections being really really quick?
Hopefully 21CN is it (time will tell) but surely this means that as more isp's come on board BT will reduce their charges and enta will be able to offer less limited usage allowances?
One thing that does puzzle me though is the LLU providers, are they all that bad? UKOnline is reasonable in terms of service but not as good as enta by any means and others such as Bulldog look alright (but shame they are owned by tiscali), the thing is though that to be a LLU provider you need to be owned by a big isp as your putting alot of kit in exchanges. Do these LLU providers have loads of cheap bandwith from somewhere that IP Stream isps are paying through the nose for to BT?
You think your going to get the same quality ISP? Every other Entanet reseller is going to be the same peak/off-peak times presumably. :rolleyes:
ADSL24 are a great ISP, I too am not impressed with the severe cut on off-peak times, but I'm still staying and am going to happily upgrade to 24Mb Broadband 35. The support is top-notch, quality is great, a friendly community forums; not many ISPs have one, let alone a close-knit and friendly one. ;)
Now I know, a lot of programs don't work with Scheduling, generally only some Torrent programs (e.g. uTorrent, I use this), and a handful of Download Managers, yet 4oD and I think BBC iPlayer doesn't work with this either...
The fact it now means I'm going to have to start leaving my PC on all night now when I upgrade, which isn't environmentally friendly, but the only time were I can download in the month and not go over my limit (peak).. It's really not working out, but I can still be happy with it; because there isn't any other ISP I could switch too that gives the support, quality and no port-blocking/throttling.
I am very happy with ADS24 and I am not planning to go to another ISp, but I am also not planning to change to the new service and to be honest if people that are complaining about the limits are happy with their speed, then why bother changing to ADSL2+?
I use Utorrent now and again, but not that often, I ahe never used or intend to use BBc Iplayer, tell a lie I had a quick look on the streaming version, for a couple of mins. the 2.5Mbits I get is plenty fast enough and going on ADSL2+ will make little difference.
"If you cant, or are not willing to leave a computer on overnight between 1am and 7am to do the bulk of your downloads, then its your problem, not adsl24 or entanets problem. "
i think it certainly is entanets problem. its there job to provide a decent service, if they cant afford to then maybe theyre in the wrong business! a customer shouldnt have to change their business or lifestyle to fit to a supplier.
if you rang up a pizza delivery service at 5pm and asked for a pizza you wouldnt expect them to tell you to have it after 1am because it would be easier for them to make it because its less busy.lol or if tesco suddenly changed all their opening times to 1am-7am because it was cheaper on the electric in the store for them , we wouldnt be expected to all go there and do the shopping in the middle of the night!
but after all that, i agree that they need to make their money back, so if they need to increase the price and reduce the bandwith available to cover the cost of the faster speeds then fair enough. theyve been clear and upfront about the changes well in advance so we all have plenty of time to weigh up the pros and cons of a switch.
aslong as the current priceplans will still be available as they are then ill remain 100% satisfied with adsl24/entanets service. for me that 10pm and weekend offpeak is one of the main points of the service they provide and probably the reason i chose adsl24.
"
aslong as the current priceplans will still be available as they are then ill remain 100% satisfied with adsl24/entanets service. for me that 10pm and weekend offpeak is one of the main points of the service they provide and probably the reason i chose adsl24.
I completely agree, I just hope that I'm not forced to sometime down the line as it would be a shame to leave. ADSL24 are a great ISP :)
gbswales
26/05/2008, 02:05
The current plans can't be changed as the way it is delivered is different to the way WBC ADSL2+ products are delivered in terms of the backhaul to/from BT. The current setup uses Central pipes which cost £millions whereas the new system does not and allows Enta to offer a little more without as much overheads. So the normal 8Mb plans cannot be changed as they are too cheap at the moment (Enta are losing large amounts on the 30/300 GB plan!)
James
I find this very worrying - if enta are losing money on the 30/300GB service then how long will it be before they re-price it. More worrying is the general notion that it is becoming difficult to deliver, economically, the increasing demand for things like
VOIP
Video / voice conferencing (a la msn)
On line video viewing
On line TV viewing
On line radio
Film and music downloads (legal)
remote desktop working
on-line gaming etc etc
Download is becoming the default distribution method for sofware (which in itself gets bigger every day) I predict that the demand will be be to buy HD DVD's and high quality music files the same way.
and who knows what else is around the corner
I sometimes wonder how much will BT have for building an infrastructure which offers the capacity to provide almost free alternatives for what they sell.
I would say at the present rate of growth the average number of GBs consumed per person will more than double year on year and the expectation will be for it to become cheaper and faster!
ISPs , even the loop unbundled, are tied down by what BT can deliver to the home and BT are tied because they have to make a profit rather than deliver an equal service to all.
They need to plan for an infrastructure now that will cope in 2-3 years time with every household downloading anything up to 500GB a month or more (thats based on say two computers running the kind of activities above) - this may sound crazy to those of you who say 10GB is plenty - but 4 years ago I had a "massive" 40gb hard drive - now my computer has a Terrrabyte and another 500 GB external - Terrabyte drives can be bought for less than my old 40GB one cost. The infrastructure is not keeping pace with the growth of technology - it's a gloomy picture and can only get worse in the short term
the-bruce
26/05/2008, 09:46
I remember the good olde days when *Unlimited* meant just that, no capping, throttling, Download limits etc ...
Here's a good analogy ...
Brucey walks into a car show room to buy a sports car (Upgrading my old honda civic) the guy says its a cracker can do 240 mph, but theres a catch, ohhhh brucey says ;)
Yes it can only do these speeds between 1am-7am after which it will continue these speeds for another 80 miles, then the speed drops to 40 mph, would you buy the car?
Atm if i want to download something i wait to 10.01pm or the weekend, if i was to move to ADSL2+ you only have a tiny window (6 hours per night)
So looks like Brucey will stick with my 8 meg connection for a while :D
Right off to work i'm saving for that sports car ;)
Brucey
xxxxx
Do these LLU providers have loads of cheap bandwith from somewhere that IP Stream isps are paying through the nose for to BT?
No centrals, all they deal with BTW for it power and rack space and the tail connection. They sort the backhaul etc out themselves.
I am very happy with ADS24 and I am not planning to go to another ISp, but I am also not planning to change to the new service and to be honest if people that are complaining about the limits are happy with their speed, then why bother changing to ADSL2+?.
Once everything is upgraded it is just a matter of time before the centrals are turned off, each one costs iirc £1.8million a year, with a £30k install, interconnects and nodes are a little cheaper and easier to maintain.
"If you cant, or are not willing to leave a computer on overnight between 1am and 7am to do the bulk of your downloads, then its your problem, not adsl24 or entanets problem. "
i think it certainly is entanets problem. its there job to provide a decent service, if they cant afford to then maybe theyre in the wrong business! a customer shouldnt have to change their business or lifestyle to fit to a supplier.
if you rang up a pizza delivery service at 5pm and asked for a pizza you wouldnt expect them to tell you to have it after 1am because it would be easier for them to make it because its less busy.lol or if tesco suddenly changed all their opening times to 1am-7am because it was cheaper on the electric in the store for them , we wouldnt be expected to all go there and do the shopping in the middle of the night!
but after all that, i agree that they need to make their money back, so if they need to increase the price and reduce the bandwith available to cover the cost of the faster speeds then fair enough. theyve been clear and upfront about the changes well in advance so we all have plenty of time to weigh up the pros and cons of a switch.
aslong as the current priceplans will still be available as they are then ill remain 100% satisfied with adsl24/entanets service. for me that 10pm and weekend offpeak is one of the main points of the service they provide and probably the reason i chose adsl24.
They could have changed the packages at any point they liked, the reason they left it till now is obviously with the new product set it was a good time, better than changing it one month and suddenly the monthly fee increased to the true cost of central bandwidth. (£200 a month for 330gb)
I remember the good olde days when *Unlimited* meant just that, no capping, throttling, Download limits etc ...
Here's a good analogy ...
Brucey walks into a car show room to buy a sports car (Upgrading my old honda civic) the guy says its a cracker can do 240 mph, but theres a catch, ohhhh brucey says ;)
Yes it can only do these speeds between 1am-7am after which it will continue these speeds for another 80 miles, then the speed drops to 40 mph, would you buy the car?
Atm if i want to download something i wait to 10.01pm or the weekend, if i was to move to ADSL2+ you only have a tiny window (6 hours per night)
So looks like Brucey will stick with my 8 meg connection for a while :D
Right off to work i'm saving for that sports car ;)
Brucey
xxxxx
New offpeak is actually unlimited with no fup either :)
You do only have 6 hours per night, but you do have a connection that is potentially 3 times faster ;)
There's a useful graph on this site (http://www.internode.on.net/residential/internet/home_adsl/extreme/) that shows how speed drops with increasing line length for an ADSL2+ connection.
Ircsum.
Looking at that chart I'm likely to get the same speed as I get now so no improvement in that means ADSL2+ offers me nothing :(
tboorman
26/05/2008, 10:31
You do only have 6 hours per night, but you do have a connection that is potentially 3 times faster ;)
As long as everyone downloading during those 6 hours does not result in the ALT throttling it to 2 Mbps.
There's a useful graph on this site (http://www.internode.on.net/residential/internet/home_adsl/extreme/) that shows how speed drops with increasing line length for an ADSL2+ connection.
Ircsum.
And here is one we made earlier :)
http://adsl24.co.uk/adsl2plus.jpg
(btw, how are you Ircsum!)
As long as everyone downloading during those 6 hours does not result in the ALT throttling it to 2 Mbps.
But overall Enta will have more capacity to deal with more bandwidth being used during peak times as the times are longer hence when it comes to off-peak the capacity will still be there, unlike now, where the capacity they have does not get filled until off-peak begins at 10PM.
As long as everyone downloading during those 6 hours does not result in the ALT throttling it to 2 Mbps.
Alt works per node now. And interconnects have 1gb per "central" as it were (central is a bad term but the easiest way to explain) and can be turned on in 100mb steps, you can light how many 100mb segments as you want in 5 working days.
ALT should not really come into effect too much on the WBC products...(in theory)
Your graph gives me slightly more than the one I linked to, James, so I prefer it :)
Still chugging along here, ta. No date set for WBC at my exchange yet so ADSL2+ is a bit academic as far as I'm concerned, but I'm happy with what I have.
Ircsum.
tboorman
26/05/2008, 11:52
But overall Enta will have more capacity to deal with more bandwidth being used during peak times as the times are longer hence when it comes to off-peak the capacity will still be there, unlike now, where the capacity they have does not get filled until off-peak begins at 10PM.
ALT should not really come into effect too much on the WBC products...(in theory)
I guess only time will tell.
tboorman
26/05/2008, 11:54
Your graph gives me slightly more than the one I linked to, James, so I prefer it :)
There's also an ADSL2+ Max speed tool at http://www.dslzoneuk.net/maxspeed2.php.
tboorman
26/05/2008, 12:01
Once everything is upgraded it is just a matter of time before the centrals are turned off, each one costs iirc £1.8million a year, with a £30k install, interconnects and nodes are a little cheaper and easier to maintain.
That's several years away though, by which time other ISPs will be offering the 24 Mbps products, and we'll know whether Entanet's prices are the best value for money or not.
There's also an ADSL2+ Max speed tool at http://www.dslzoneuk.net/maxspeed2.php.
Hmmmm.....not quite as good. Think I prefer to believe James's graph rather than his site tool. :D
Ircsum.
Speedtouch or Netgear DG 834GT.
James at the moment I'm using a Netgear DG 834v3. I've been thinking of upgrading to a DG 834GT in the near future. Apart from the ability to tweak the snr do you think this upgrade would be worthwhile bearing in mind I hope to move over to ADSL2+ when it becomes available.
James at the moment I'm using a Netgear DG 834v3. I've been thinking of upgrading to a DG 834GT in the near future. Apart from the ability to tweak the snr do you think this upgrade would be worthwhile bearing in mind I hope to move over to ADSL2+ when it becomes available.
Better chipsets, The G is Texas Instruments, where as the GT is the Broadcom used by the Speedtouches.
Guess I'll go for it then.
Thanks for the fast reply :)
Wow! ADSL2+ Is the same price as my current ADSL plan - But with 5GB more on-peak!
But I doubt they'll upgrade our exchange in the next decade, since i live on anglesey :(
Guess I'll go for it then.
Thanks for the fast reply :)
gt is far better :)
abuelito
26/05/2008, 17:27
Interesting discussion. I appreciate that ISPs and resellers like Enta need to make a living, but the comment that the technology hasn't kept up with the demand is very true.
Yes, I could schedule downloads between 1am-7am but I don't want to be forced to do so. If I see something interesting, I want to be able to download it on the spot. We are all more and more dependent on the internet for everything from shopping, banking etc to entertainment. It can be done. If I lived in Japan or Korea or even I'm told, Finland, , I could download as much as I want, at any hour I want, at speed of up to 100mbps and at a much lower cost. The technology exists but neither the Government nor BT are able or willing to fund the expenditure that would be needed.
Now none of this is ADSL24's fault. They are a great ISP - not only would I hate to leave them, but I doubt whether I'd find the grass greener anywhere else (barring "special, time-limited "offers"). However, surely Entanet's proposals were discussed with their resellers beforehand? Was any pressure put on them to think again about the time/price structure so as to offer a realistic set of alternatives to their customers.
Mention was made of BBC iPlayer. I've looked at it but don't like the idea of letting someone upload as much as they want from bandwidth. I'd also be worried about their adware. See
http://www.bit-tech.net/news/2007/08/16/bbc_iplayer_hogware/1.
As far as I know, this is still the position.
All this talk of adsl2+ is just academic for those of us who live so far away from their exchanges that even a consistent 2.4Mbps (rather than 24) would be an exciting development.
This isn't a moan about Entanet or ADSL24. I've no intention of leaving, they (and this forum) have served me well and hopefully will continue to do so for a long time yet, and I'm prepared to pay a little extra for good, reliable service. I just wish that BT (or the government) would get a plan together to provide proper broadband to what I believe must be quite a large minority still struggling with bad connections and/or at the end of long strands of copper wire. It's thirty years or more now since copper was seen as a backwater, not the future, and yet home consumers are still stuck with it.
Wow! ADSL2+ Is the same price as my current ADSL plan - But with 5GB more on-peak!
But I doubt they'll upgrade our exchange in the next decade, since i live on anglesey :(
Have a look here, it'll tell you when upgrades are due, you can even sign up to get emailed about it....
http://www.samknows.com/broadband/countydetail.php?county=82
________
vaporite solo (http://vaporizer.org/reviews/vaporite-solo)
tboorman
26/05/2008, 21:42
Wow! ADSL2+ Is the same price as my current ADSL plan - But with 5GB more on-peak!
Make sure you note the difference in off-peak times though - it's only 1 am to 7 am seven days a week on the 24 Mbps plans.
tboorman
26/05/2008, 21:46
Mention was made of BBC iPlayer. I've looked at it but don't like the idea of letting someone upload as much as they want from bandwidth. I'd also be worried about their adware. See
http://www.bit-tech.net/news/2007/08/16/bbc_iplayer_hogware/1.
As far as I know, this is still the position.
You don't have to use the Download Manager though - you can use the streaming method to watch a programme if you prefer.
Kobrakai
26/05/2008, 21:47
Make sure you note the difference in off-peak times though - it's only 1 am to 7 am seven days a week on the 24 Mbps plans.
Yeah its a shame, now I have to find a new ISP :(
Ok I just found this thread . Forgive me if this has been answered. My not so great line has returned to a relatively reasonable 1meg on MAX currently - now the big question. If my exchange is ready and i believe it will be soon - will this mean I can get almost definitely get an improved speed ?
Ok Having read the thread and looked at the chart - given that I currently have a line attentuation of 63 I might get a slight increase - estimated 2-4meg - but who really knows ? Now will it be possible to try the new plan for a month or so and change back if we don't like it ?
Ok Having read the thread and looked at the chart - given that I currently have a line attentuation of 63 I might get a slight increase - estimated 2-4meg - but who really knows ? Now will it be possible to try the new plan for a month or so and change back if we don't like it ?
Think that James posted somewhere on this forum that there is no way back.
So do we have any news to what would be the limit when the GB allowance is exceeded???
I would really like to know...
1 step before deciding to upgrade...
So do we have any news to what would be the limit when the GB allowance is exceeded???
I would really like to know...
1 step before deciding to upgrade...
If you exceed your limit, your connection speed is capped to a yet unknown figure, you can get past this by getting a topup.
Ok I just found this thread . Forgive me if this has been answered. My not so great line has returned to a relatively reasonable 1meg on MAX currently - now the big question. If my exchange is ready and i believe it will be soon - will this mean I can get almost definitely get an improved speed ?
Something that long the increase will be negligible. Maybe 1mb to 1.5mb, but the new equipment should help improve stability.
Ok Having read the thread and looked at the chart - given that I currently have a line attentuation of 63 I might get a slight increase - estimated 2-4meg - but who really knows ? Now will it be possible to try the new plan for a month or so and change back if we don't like it ?
I don't believe this is possible but will get clarification..
Only a marginal speed improvement for me as well, I wonder how many will actually get anything near 24 meg
I believe smidge posted on TBB that it IS possible to revert to ADSL1 if things don't work out for a customer on ADSL2+.
Ircsum.
edit: read it here (http://bbs.adslguide.org.uk/showthreaded.php?Cat=&Board=entanet&Number=3361548&page=0&view=collapsed&sb=5&o=0).
Apologies if this has been covered earlier as I just skimmed part of the thread.
I'm currently very happy on the 30/300 package, I ony get 3.5mb due to line length. I don't have my line figures to hand but I don't think my speed would increase enough to warrant changing.
My main question is will I be able to stay on this package, with existing peak/offpeak times for good or will I eventually be moved off of it ?
tboorman
27/05/2008, 14:20
My main question is will I be able to stay on this package, with existing peak/offpeak times for good or will I eventually be moved off of it ?
There are no plans to change the existing plans for the time being.
ChunkyBloke
27/05/2008, 14:42
My 2p's worth: Having migrated over to ADSL24 last Friday (apart from me somehow managing to reset my router to factory defaults by mistake it was a totally painless experience - thankyou ADSL24!!!) I came from an ISP that had off-peak allowance between 1am and 6am 7 days a week. I was totally used to this and was happy to schedule any large downloads between those times.
Moving to ADSL24 having the weekend counting as off-peak is a complete bonus. But having said that I wouldn't be too put-off if I had to go back to that kind of regime - you get used to it and and change your downloading habits accordingly. Nearly all download managers have some sort of scheduling and there are utilities about that allow your PC to wake-up at a particular time from a low power state and then shut it down again at a particular time/ when downloading has finished. Not totally green but better than leaving your machine on ALL night.
For those of you who mention BBC iPlayer/4OD etc there is a little utility called TVODMonitor (free) which has a scheduler for the background P2P service (kservice)
That should cover your scheduled downloading of most content.
I live a reasonable distance from my exchange (63db downstream) giving me an IP Profile of 1500kbps. When you have these kind of download speeds, ANY improvement to your speed is very welcome and from what I can gather from various graphs, calculators etc is that I should be able to double my speed. Now for me that far outweighs any 'incoveniences' with having to schedule downloads. (and with more peak allowance and for the same cost)
Until we all have a nice little fibre connection to our homes, we have to make the best of what is available and there are always (as with anything in life) compromises to be made.
Copper wires are indeed very old technology for the delivery of broadband internet connections, but for some of us the situation is slightly worse. I know for a fact that the last leg of my line from the exchange doesn't even use copper - it uses aluminium wire (which dates my cabling to around the 1940's as copper was in short supply during WW2 where as the UK had its own supply of aluminium) Aluminium degrades much faster than copper and with age becomes brittle and prone to fractures. These fractures then act as tiny little capacitors reducing the high frequencies used for broadband delivery.
However there may be light at the end of the (very long and smelly!) tunnel: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/technology/7387836.stm
Until then, ADSL2+ provides a glimmer of hope for those of us who don't live close to their exchange. I, for one, will be embracing ADSL2+ as soon as possible.
Chunky
Let's see unless I am missing something - currently on the 30/300 plan - I could get 35/unlimited for the same amount 19.99 - or manage my downoads more carefully or top up -
The worse aspect is that the change of peak hours and they fact that the weekend makes no difference. I guess it's more a matter of looking at your overall usage and having the top up when required.
Now if this can be guaranteed to be no worse for users than current technology .....
-
The overall issue is that the allowances were far too generous to start with and losing Enta a lot of money every month. Offering a service with 330GB bandwidth for £19.99 was a mistake by Enta in the beginning and meant that it simply was not sustainable and caused all sorts of issues such as the 10PM crawl and slowdowns most of the weekend.
When you compare the new prices with the current, it looks like you are losing out, but for the majority of people, it will be better overall. People want as much bandwidth as possible, as fast a speed as possible and for as cheap as possible, but that just isn't viable in the broadband market if today unless you go for one of the "big named ISPs" and have a woeful service, poor speeds and not very good support.
Look at the bigger picture -
1) More peak allowance
2) Higher download speeds (for most, even if just a little)
3) Higher upload speeds (1Mb+ for most)
4) Better stability as ADSL2+ offers many advantages over plain ADSL
5) Unlimited off-peak (as others say, you are not losing the 300GB off-peak, you are getting more off-peak allowance as it's not monitored!, albeit at a later time during the night - but does this really matter - you are paying for peak bandwidth, schedule your downloads and enjoy unlimited off-peak!)
6) No overusage fees (£5+vat admin fee etc) and the ability to just topup if you require it. Topups do not expire and roll over each month until used up
7) Ability to change target SNR profiles (not fully confirmed yet!) (Normal = 6dB SNR, Stable = 9 or 12dB SNR and Super stable = 15dB SNR we think) - helping many people who have line issues or an SNR that is too high and causing lower SYNC speeds.
If you just compare it with the existing package, you are getting more speed, more overall allowance with the peak and off-peak periods (regardless of the times) and the above advantages to point out a few.
I do know that Enta has spent millions in investments for 21CN, and are the first ISP to have such a presence on the 21CN scene which is a credit to their network and planning team. I still believe the prices that are being offered (especially up to the Broadband 35 package) are very competive and even break in to the LLU price range for many. If you were to not know the current packages, would you still think the new ones are not competitive? Enta have to make some money back before they even break even no doubt.
I appreciate the plans may not suit everyone, which is why we will not be forcing any customers to take up the above packages when their exchange is upgraded. The line will be migrated to the WBC platform, but you will remain on the ADSL1 profile and plan. We will e-mail every customer in advance to inform you that you are able to change the package from a date and then it's up to you :)
We've done lookups on our customer base and actually find that over 60% of customers on the current 30GB package are actually using less than 10GB peak under the new peak times, so for these it will actually mean that they could go for the Broadband 10 package, save £5 each month, and have higher speeds and all the other benefits. We will lose a lot of commission per month from Enta but that's what we have to do for our customers as they come first - plus our hands are tied by Enta so we have to make the most of what they have announced.
James
Never had course to complain about the excellent service provided by ADSL24/Entanet, but with the new line speed capabilities the "Peak allowances" are very poor. The changing face of media content downloads both free and pay for and the ability to be able to watch it anytime of day, these peak allowances maybe restrictive.
Cliff
Having had a more detailed look at the adsl2+ product, it would seem that, even on my existing poor and slow connection, I should get a more stable and slightly faster connection. I will also get the same peak package at a reduced price, with the downside of reduced off-peak time. Any improvement in connection would be a bonus for me. The reduced off-peak is manageable because I could upgrade my package and still pay less than I'm paying now. That sounds like a win-win combination to me - unless my understanding is way out.
What about modem/routers? Will the new product require a router upgrade or will the old ones work ok (currently have a DG834G)?
merlin99
28/05/2008, 12:12
Having had a more detailed look at the adsl2+ product, it would seem that, even on my existing poor and slow connection, I should get a more stable and slightly faster connection. I will also get the same peak package at a reduced price, with the downside of reduced off-peak time. Any improvement in connection would be a bonus for me. The reduced off-peak is manageable because I could upgrade my package and still pay less than I'm paying now. That sounds like a win-win combination to me - unless my understanding is way out.
What about modem/routers? Will the new product require a router upgrade or will the old ones work ok (currently have a DG834G)?
your no entirely correct with your facts and figures you well well be on the same package peak time download limit wise however dont forget that peak time is extended by at least 4 hours a day if your on a home package and 6 hours a day if your on a office package
and at the weekend 7am till 1am is again peaktime so thats another 36 hours of peaktime if your on the home package
the above figures may not be an issue if your not close to your download limits now however if your close to your peaktime limit on the package your on now then factor in the extra 50+ hours a week before asking for the upgrade
i personaly on a office 45 package and for the same money(well almost) my speeds almost double each way plus i get a jump from 45 gigs peak time usage to 80 however that extra 35 gigs has to be spread over an extra 60+ hours
the "true and honest" unlimited offpeak is nice though (assuming the same speed issues dont happen)
All good points, Merlin but I was just adding my peak & off-peak usage together and using that as a basis for my total requirements. Currently I sometimes get close to my peak allowance but never anywhere near the off-peak limit.
tboorman
28/05/2008, 13:57
What about modem/routers? Will the new product require a router upgrade or will the old ones work ok (currently have a DG834G)?
Have a look at http://adsl24.co.uk/hardware_test.php.
That's very useful. Thanks Tim, looks like my V3 still has some life left in it :D
UPDATE TODAY (http://adsl24.co.uk/forum/showpost.php?p=61760&postcount=1)
That sort of response is what makes adsl24 a great isp!
the-bruce
28/05/2008, 18:50
That sort of response is what makes adsl24 a great isp!
I totally agree with yah m8
Brucey
xxxxx
Big enough to cope -small enough to care....
tboorman
28/05/2008, 21:14
That's excellent news James.
I can see some cracks opening here, I just don't think that the set out for it will be suitable to me as a BBCi and ITV Catch up user.
Its a shame, because apart from the few little niggles that ANYONE is bound to get, its definatley one of the better ISP's out there. That said, I will now be keeping an eye out for price releases and PEAK/OFF PEAK timing with other ISP's
It is because of services like Iplayer that things have to change. You will find in time that other ISps will change their limits or charge you more.
Since i don't use Iplayer or ITv catch up for that matter, it is not a big problem for me. I do have a look on you tube a couple of times a week, but the quality of their stuff is so low that the amount of bandwidth they take is minimal.
Games players may notice a difference.
Anyway at the end of the day you are not being forced to moved onto the new service, so you have a choice, either faster speeds with usage limits that don't suit or slower speed with usage limits that do.
Once everything is upgraded it is just a matter of time before the centrals are turned off, each one costs iirc £1.8million a year, with a £30k install, interconnects and nodes are a little cheaper and easier to maintain.
Maybe so, but it still don't mean I have to go for ADSl2+, I was told that on the other forum by Entanet. I can still stay on the ADSL1 profile. there have to be4 some backwards compatability anyway, as there are still loads of people who have routers and modems tat can not cope with ADSL2, never mind 2+.
I know numerous amount of people that still uses a USB modem and they would never cope with the faster speed even if they had the technology inside to do so.
You said about the limits on the ADSL1 service losing Enta money because of the usage limits. Surely it should balance itself out? One person may come close to their usage,, but say 3 other people use very little.
I don't think I use a awful lot compared to some people and I know that over the last couple of weeks I have used more than I normally do and more than other people.
I believe smidge posted on TBB that it IS possible to revert to ADSL1 if things don't work out for a customer on ADSL2+.
Ircsum.
edit: read it here (http://bbs.adslguide.org.uk/showthreaded.php?Cat=&Board=entanet&Number=3361548&page=0&view=collapsed&sb=5&o=0).
ADSL1 profile, you will still be on the 21CN thing, but then we will be changed over to that anyway. What smidge did not say is if te limits would be set back to ADSL1.
For those of you who mention BBC iPlayer/4OD etc there is a little utility called TVODMonitor (free) which has a scheduler for the background P2P service (kservice)
That should cover your scheduled downloading of most content.
I live a reasonable distance from my exchange (63db downstream) giving me an IP Profile of 1500kbps. When you have these kind of download speeds, ANY improvement to your speed is very welcome and from what I can gather from various graphs, calculators etc is that I should be able to double my speed. Now for me that far outweighs any 'incoveniences' with having to schedule downloads. (and with more peak allowance and for the same cost)
Until then, ADSL2+ provides a glimmer of hope for those of us who don't live close to their exchange. I, for one, will be embracing ADSL2+ as soon as possible.
Chunky
Don't use and never have used Iplayer, so not a problem for me, can't see myself using it in the future either even when I get freesa
Anyway your Line Attenuation is worse than mine which is 57, I worked out by different graphs and information around the net that I may if lucky get another Mbit. at the moment I am synced at 3200Mbits, which is pretty good for me, must be because I turned off interleaving. Ok I could get more than 1Mbit extra, but as I have seen on the net I could get less than I get now.
I doubt you will get much advantage with your Line Attenuation if any.
ChunkyBloke
29/05/2008, 11:33
Anyway your Line Attenuation is worse than mine which is 57, I worked out by different graphs and information around the net that I may if lucky get another Mbit. at the moment I am synced at 3200Mbits, which is pretty good for me, must be because I turned off interleaving. Ok I could get more than 1Mbit extra, but as I have seen on the net I could get less than I get now.
I doubt you will get much advantage with your Line Attenuation if any.
I know my line att'n is pretty poor, and I was hoping that ADSL2+ might give me an improvement - but if not, it would be nice to have the ability to go back to the current Max service I'm on. From what I've read here, it seems very unclear if this would be possible. Maybe I won't jump straightaway and wait a while to see what the initial reaction to 21CN/ADSL2+ is like. For me, as I said previously, the reduced off-peak times is not an issue, but a faster connection would be welcome. Horses for courses...
Chunky
Well I now have a headache coming on after reading through the 13 pages worth!
(I thought James said only sensible discussion.. :p ).
I think the packages look very good. I'll be one of those switching to the 10GB package as I've only gone over that total usage twice since August.
However, as I'm over 2.5 miles from the exchange my service is not good. On MAX I have great difficulty getting over 512k with any stability, so I've been on a fixed 1Meg package for the last 18 months or so.
I see that only MAX packages are available with the adsl2+ service, so I fear for my stability and speed.
3 years ago I was with tiscali (yes, I was that mug...) and they told me (from India!!) that my attenuation was about 53dB. At that time, BT Wholesale rated my line as a definite 1MB and possible 1.5MB.
Over the last 6 months, BT Wholesale have reduced that, first to 1MB and recently to 512k. This is nuts! Why has this supposedly happened (I don't believe it - and I'm getting just under 1MB with adsl24)?
I asked James about this before and his answer was not to worry about it because it was not important. But I don't agree, James, because that estimate is what ISPs use to offer me a service. I have no intention of leaving adsl24, but if I wanted to, no-one will offer me more than 512k - because that's what BT are quoting as my top reliable speed.
Using different references, it seems like I would get around 3MB on adsl2+, which would be great.
But I'm not convinced. If I look at the attenuation rate on those graphs - it looks like 3MB-ish is right. But if I look at my current speed - then adsl2+ would mean a negligible increase in speed.
How am I supposed to decide whether upgrading is for me, when I don't even know how it is going to affect me? (I will be ordering one of those luvverly modems you have for sale there, though, thanx! :) )
PS - can't check my current attenuation on my DG632 as I get an error when trying to run the telnet command.
On ADSL2+ we will have an option to cap the SYNC rate at a fixed speed (512kb/1Mb/2Mb) etc like it is now, if you have stability issues.
James
PS - can't check my current attenuation on my DG632 as I get an error when trying to run the telnet command.
What error are you getting? You probably just haven't enabled debug mode first ;)
to enable debug enter the following into the browser address bar:
http://192.168.0.1/cgi-bin/webcm?todo=debug
(where '192.168.0.1' is the IP address of the router)
Telnet into the router.
at the prompt type the following:
cat /proc/avalanche/avsar_modem_stats
That should give you the relevant details :)
That's encouraging, James - I hope there will be a way of reliably guestimating my achievable speed before syncing to a specific one.
As for the telnet - well I'm fully aware of the router addressing, debugging etc etc etc and am capable of following the printed instructions linked to by James, thank you:rolleyes:
and am capable of following the printed instructions linked to by James
not seeing any linked instructions, but ok ... I apologise for trying to assist :rolleyes:
the_quick
03/06/2008, 10:46
It is very good seeing ADSL24 is up to date with 21C network. Only don't like this offpeak time - but James already told they will review it. Now reading PC Pro and there is about 21CN - Entanet works very close with BT on this. Interesting article :)
My exchange is due to 18/08/08 - but will see how peak/offpeak times will change.
The Villan
03/06/2008, 16:38
Ha might have guessed it. James and Bt have left us in the sticks to be the last as usual :-)
Did the check and we are not planned to be upgraded in the forseable future.
So are 8mb prices going to be ruduced as the new speeds are introduced. As I see it at the moment, what we have now on 8MB will be the same price for 24MB?
Just thought I would do my grumpy old men of England bit.
Now now, Les, don't get all uppity just 'cos you're last in the queue again! Apparently there's been some research done recently that confirms that London area b/band speeds are between 50% and 100% faster than elsewhere in the country. London gets 4Mbps, elsewhere 2 to 3 Mbps.
I wish!!!
No, the current 8Mb prices cannot be touched as BT still charge the same for them and the way the bandwidth is delivered is still via central pipes. What you will all notice is that your speeds will increase as more people move over to the ADSL2+ service as the central pipes will become less used.
James
How long will the central pipes stay operational, before moving to ADSL+2 becomes compulsory?
not seeing any linked instructions, but ok ... I apologise for trying to assist :rolleyes:
:p
I look forward to the new speed and the unlimited offpeak downloads, but I notice that the offpeak has changed from 10pm to 1am.
I am on 30/300 option and off peak is currently 10pm to 8am, weekends offpeak.
I will want to stay on a service that allows me to download at a reasonable times, I would prefer to see offpeak start at 6pm, which was offpeak many years ago on dialup.
I do appreciate your service though and what you offer.
Well, my new Speedtouch 585v7 tells me that my attenuation is now 63.5 - so my speed increase will be negligible.
Knowing that there is not likely to be any "major upgrades" as BT like to call them for many years - that leaves me a very angry teddy. They should sort out the areas that have cr@p service/speeds first - then start doing upgrades for the people who already have the cream on the cake.
The sewer-mounted :D system looks like the best bet (a la BBC report (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/7435088.stm) ). 50MB/s? - Yes, please!
http://www.speedtest.net/result/279930972.png (http://www.speedtest.net)
Off-peak simply cannot start at 6PM as the days of dial-up are no more. Fact is, 6PM is very much peak as most people will bne online at this time. Same with weekend really, which was previously off-peak.
The Villan
04/06/2008, 21:41
Come on you lot get on ADSL2+ quickly, so I can get faster speeds LOL :-)
The Villan
04/06/2008, 21:43
Oh I forgot to say. James you are not allowed to cut me off in my prime, if we can't get it for a year or more. Promise.
Well one of the sites linked to in this thread tells me that my speed should be 2 to 4MB/s - but looking at James' graph, it's more likely to be 2 than 4.
Actually - that would be very welcome - a fixed 2MB connection would be twice my current speed and would make me much happier. :)
Anything above that would be a bonus. :eek:
ChunkyBloke
05/06/2008, 11:24
Well, my new Speedtouch 585v7 tells me that my attenuation is now 63.5 - so my speed increase will be negligible.
Knowing that there is not likely to be any "major upgrades" as BT like to call them for many years - that leaves me a very angry teddy. They should sort out the areas that have cr@p service/speeds first - then start doing upgrades for the people who already have the cream on the cake.
Ditto to that John. I'm wondering if BT (or someone) will produce a line checker like they have for the current services with a reliable predictor for speed. Trouble is, for those of us on longer lines we don't know if we're really going to see any benefit.
Chunky
Ojustabo
05/06/2008, 14:01
Well it goes like this….
You can please some of the people some of the time, but you can’t please all of the people all of the time.
If you cant, or are not willing to leave a computer on overnight between 1am and 7am to do the bulk of your downloads, then its your problem, not adsl24 or entanets problem.
In all fairness, not all large usage is down to downloads that can be scheduled.
Streaming of TV shows/films is becoming more and more popular and only yesterday I was looking at a site where the MINIMUM spec to receive a 1080p HD stream with 5.1 audio was 13.5 Mbps
Ojustabo
05/06/2008, 14:18
I presume
21CN WBC status:
and
21CN PSTN switchover target:
are two different things?
I'm due to get WBC in may 2009 but the PSTN switch over isn't until Q3 2011
Yep, they are different. The PSTN switchover is the phone line services, and WBC is ADSL2+
raceylady
06/06/2008, 11:34
Like the packages, one question James you say unlimited for offpeak, I hope there will be no fup policy connected to this and does mean unlimited and no reduction in speed if using more bandwidth.
Oh and can I contact bt to try and find out if my exchange has any plans for upgrading, I know the checker doesn't give me a date.
merlin99
07/06/2008, 00:25
Like the packages, one question James you say unlimited for offpeak, I hope there will be no fup policy connected to this and does mean unlimited and no reduction in speed if using more bandwidth.
Oh and can I contact bt to try and find out if my exchange has any plans for upgrading, I know the checker doesn't give me a date.
taken from the ADSL24 page that has the 24meg lines on
Off-peak is defined as 1am to 7am seven days a week and offers unlimited usage with no fair usage policy
carnt see them doing anything underhand or hidden and not doing whats wrote in black in and white
after all thats this ISPs main selling point ....fully upfront and honest
Like the packages, one question James you say unlimited for offpeak, I hope there will be no fup policy connected to this and does mean unlimited and no reduction in speed if using more bandwidth.
Oh and can I contact bt to try and find out if my exchange has any plans for upgrading, I know the checker doesn't give me a date.
1) If you use over your PEAK bandwidth your connection will be rate limited (not sure to what figure yet) but no rate limiting off peak as long as you have peak bandwidth on your account. (Of course that is not including congestion at the exchange for example if you are on a rural one)
2) Its going to be after 2009 but they may send us an updated date sooner :)
Englishman
07/06/2008, 07:45
One question to ask with ADSL MAX i got line disconnections because i live a fair way from the exchange will i get disconnections with ADSL2+
raceylady
07/06/2008, 07:51
taken from the ADSL24 page that has the 24meg lines on
carnt see them doing anything underhand or hidden and not doing whats wrote in black in and white
after all thats this ISPs main selling point ....fully upfront and honest
Liking this better and more than pleased since I have been with adsl24 no other isp for me.
raceylady
07/06/2008, 07:54
1) If you use over your PEAK bandwidth your connection will be rate limited (not sure to what figure yet) but no rate limiting off peak as long as you have peak bandwidth on your account. (Of course that is not including congestion at the exchange for example if you are on a rural one)
2) Its going to be after 2009 but they may send us an updated date sooner :)
Good news I will go for the 35g peak and unlimited offpeak as soon as I can get the 24mb, there was a link somewhere to test to see what speed you would get I think I came out at around 18mb- 19mb.
2) Shame its going to be over a year for me to wait, Umph where are my tissues.:(
Ojustabo
08/06/2008, 00:00
Yep, they are different. The PSTN switchover is the phone line services, and WBC is ADSL2+
Many thanks
1) If you use over your PEAK bandwidth your connection will be rate limited (not sure to what figure yet) but no rate limiting off peak as long as you have peak bandwidth on your account.
Now this is still not clear. What sort of limit is likely ? Say I am normally on my usual
1 meg - what reduced speed would I expect if I went over my allowance and hadn't topped up and would this reduced rate apply to offpeak use if peak bandwidth is exceeded?
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Gargoyle
09/06/2008, 07:20
The overall issue is that the allowances were far too generous to start with and losing Enta a lot of money every month. Offering a service with 330GB bandwidth for £19.99 was a mistake by Enta in the beginning and meant that it simply was not sustainable and caused all sorts of issues such as the 10PM crawl and slowdowns most of the weekend.
I never could work out how Entanet could make money on it.
They go off the principal that most users won't use the full peak bandwidth as this is what costs Entanet.
Enta have announced that they are putting back the launch of ADSL 2/2+ services based upon BT's WBC platform until after the middle of July. This is due to a number of issues that BT failed to resolve in time for a launch this month which Enta had hoped for.
OK, I've scanned through this entire post and not seen it mentioned anywhere.
On the product page it says that for and extra £6.99 a month you can get the Office Premium which "Offers higher priority at the exchange - faster speeds when you need it most. Similar to having the Office service (Max Premium) on our 8Mb plans."
Does it also off similar peak times to the current office plan (8am-8pm) which after all tends to cover most office hours. or would the office plans also be limited with this 1am-7am off-peak time - and if that is the case, what exactly do you get for £6.99 a month extra?
Thanks,
Phil
No. Off-peak times are not changed. Only the exchange priority.
Which mean what exactly?
It sounds like rather a lot of money just to have a higher priority. How would you know if it was actually beneficial (other than try with and without)?
At least now I know what to expect. My exchange isn't upgraded till early next year but BE (and others) are already offering ADSL2... I really like the service and contracts your offering on ADSL but I'm not so keen on the adsl2 offereings from Entanet and thus yourselves :(
Thanks
Phil
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